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  • Concorde.

    Time to give this old girl her own thread.


    I will kick off with this news concerning the terrible accident in Paris 10 years ago.


    A four month court case will try to determine blame for the Air France Concorde crash.

    Ten years after the event, a court in France is about to try and determine exactly who was to blame for the accident that claimed the lives of 113 people in July 2000. The court will be re-examining all of the evidence, including previously ignored statements from 28 eye witnesses that claim the doomed jet was on fire before it got to the part of the runway where the metal strip was found. The metal strip, an 18 inch long piece of titanium, was previously blamed for causing the tyre burst starting the train of events that lead to the jet crashing shortly after take off.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...h-1885168.html

    You will notice that 3 of the accused are charged with failing to respond appropriately to previous tyre/fuel tank problems with Concorde. In the 24 years of service leading up to the fatal flight, Concorde suffered 65 tyre blowouts, and 6 of those led to fuel tank ruptures.

    I have always been a massive fan of Concorde, but after reading several reports relating to tyre bursts and fuel tank ruptures, even i have to admit that the problem should have been dealt with properly when they first realised there was a design fault. Especially when i read of one take off incident at Washington-Dulles Airport where a double tyre burst punctured three fuel tanks, severed several hydraulic lines and electrical wires, damaged number 2 engine, it also tore a large hole on the top of the wing, over the wheel well area. The plane made an emergency landing, when it came to a standstill the ground all around the plane was immediately covered in aviation fuel that was leaking from the plane. A very lucky escape i feel.

    Yes, after that, and other similar incidents, they did make some design mods to the undercarriage in order to try and eliminate some of the problems and reduce future risks, but i do not think they did anything to try and strengthen or protect the tanks against future tyre bursts.

    You could, i guess, say that the Paris disaster was a disaster just waiting to happen. But were there any other factors that contributed to the fatal tyre burst other than the 18 inch strip of metal? After the crash there were various other rumors going around, but i believe the air accident investigation placed the main blame for the accident with the 18 inch strip of metal.

    But it would seem that the French Courts are about to re-examine all of the evidence. In the following quote from a 'Wiki' article, you can see that they will have a great deal to consider. Some of the issues raised are very interesting.

    Alternative theories

    British investigators and former French Concorde pilots looked at several other possibilities that the report ignored, including an unbalanced weight distribution in the fuel tanks and loose landing gear. They came to the conclusion that the Concorde veered off course on the runway, which reduced take-off speed below the crucial minimum. The aircraft had passed close to a Boeing 747 known to be carrying French President Jacques Chirac who was returning from the 26th G8 summit meeting in Okinawa, Japan.

    They argued that the Concorde was in trouble before takeoff, as it was overweight for the given conditions, with an excessively aft center of gravity and taking off downwind. They claim that when it stood at the end of the runway, ready to roll, it was more than six tonnes over its approved maximum takeoff weight for the given conditions.

    Moreover, it was missing the crucial spacer from the left main landing-gear beam that would have made for a snug-fitting pivot. This compromised the alignment of the landing gear and the wobbling beam and gears allowing three degrees of movement possible in any direction. The uneven load on the left leg’s three remaining tyres skewed the landing gear disastrously, with the scuff marks of four tyres on the runway showing that the plane was skidding out of control.

    Finally, Brian Trubshaw and John Cochrane, the Concorde's two test pilots when the aircraft was being developed in the early 1970s, set the aft operating limit at 54 per cent - beyond that, they found, it risked becoming uncontrollable, likely to rear up backwards and crash, exactly as Flight 4590 did in its final moments over Gonesse. However, Flight 4590's centre of gravity went beyond 54 per cent, with the BEA stating a figure of 54.2 per cent, while a senior industry source said that the true figure may have been worse: with the extra fuel and bags, it may have been up to 54.6 per cent.

    These investigators were frustrated by the lack of cooperation from French authorities, including an unwillingness to share data and the immediate resurfacing of the Concorde's take off runway after the crash. They alleged that the BEA was determined to place the sole blame of the accident on the titanium strip to show that the Concorde itself was not at fault. The piece of metal from the DC-10 was found 7 meters forward, and 37 meters to the right of where the Concorde's tyre blew.
    It will be interesting to see what the Court decides.
    Your charts, your radar, your eyes and ears - if all 4 agree, you may proceed with caution.

  • #2
    Now that's enough to put you off your driving!

    Official license


    The last ever flight of any Concorde, 26th November 2003. The aircraft (G-BOAF) is overflying Filton airfield at two thousand feet to take a wide circle over the Bristol area before the final landing on the Filton (Bristol) runway from which she first flew in 1979, and from which the first British Concorde flew in 1969.

    Adrian Pingstone.


    Concorde and the Red Arrows on a flypast for the Queens Golden Jubilee.

    Official license
    Last edited by Steve.B; February 6th, 2010, 03:40. Reason: Adding image.
    Your charts, your radar, your eyes and ears - if all 4 agree, you may proceed with caution.

    Comment


    • #3
      Great theme for a thread!!!
      I've seen Concorde live, fully operational at JFK in New York, but back then (1987) , my camera equipement were not at hand ().
      Nevertheless, this is the Concorde F-BVFF of Air France on display near the big roundabout at Paris Charles de Gaulle airport
      "IF GOD COULD MAKE ANGELS...., WHY IN HELL MAKE MAN?"

      Comment


      • #4
        Totally agree.... about time to put the Concorde back on the board...

        From the old forum, we have these old threads with some reading:

        Concorde in New York

        Concorde wins UK design prize, beating Spitfire

        Japan and the US is working on a new Concorde-like super jet
        With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

        Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
        Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
        Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
        Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

        Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

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        • #5
          I have some images as well of the Concordes... the first one, I took in 1999 or 2000 at Bangkok International Airport:

          With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

          Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
          Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
          Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
          Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

          Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

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          • #6
            The Concorde flypast:



            With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

            Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
            Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
            Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
            Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

            Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

            Comment


            • #7
              Unknown source:

              With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

              Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
              Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
              Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
              Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

              Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

              Comment


              • #8
                GB-OAA:

                With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

                Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
                Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
                Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
                Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

                Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

                Comment


                • #9
                  GB-OAE:



                  GB-OAF:



                  GB-OAG:

                  With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

                  Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
                  Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
                  Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
                  Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

                  Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Prototype Concorde:

                    With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

                    Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
                    Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
                    Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
                    Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

                    Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

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                    • #11
                      Fantastic images of her/them. It is still hard to except that they no longer take to the air. When i lived in South London and Surrey, seeing Concorde in the sky was a routine daily event. You could always tell it was Concorde without looking, she sounded so different to everything else. I say you didn't need to look, but you always would, despite it being a daily occurrence, i would always stop and look up at her, even if she was hidden in the clouds, i would always hope to spot her in a small clearing. Over the streets of South London she would always make her banked turn onto the final approach to Heathrow. In the evenings with the sun glinting off her as she banked around, she looked truly stunning.

                      Will she ever fly again? All the powers to be keep saying "No, no, no." But who knows in the years to come?, attitudes may change, someone with the right powers and influence may want to see one of these pieces of history flying again. It as happened with other planes, so i do not think we can say with certainty that none of them will ever take off again.

                      Concorde also featured heavily in the 'Aircraft's on Google Earth' thread in this current forum. HERE.

                      And in the 'Extreme Flying or Landing' thread you can see Concorde aborting a landing due to the strong crosswinds. HERE.

                      Also in that thread you can see her performing a "Touch and Go" in the wet! Here.
                      Your charts, your radar, your eyes and ears - if all 4 agree, you may proceed with caution.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Main office of Concorde F-BTSD at Le Bourget 2009:


                        Cabin interior of Concorde F-WTSS at Le Bourget 2009:


                        Main office of F-WTSS:


                        Port engines of F-WTSS


                        F-WTSS


                        F-WTSS tailfin


                        F-WTSS port fuselage and wing


                        F-WTSS was used to fly during Eclipse Solaire 1973 over Africa, hence the logo


                        F-WTSS


                        F-BTSD


                        This concludes what I have in my archives with the beautiful Concorde.
                        "IF GOD COULD MAKE ANGELS...., WHY IN HELL MAKE MAN?"

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Thank you Sterkoder for those great shots!

                          Interesting to see the comparisons in the two flight decks - F-BTSD, and the prototype F-WTSS. And what a difference the change of visors made to the external appearance of the plane. I prefer the later visor, and looking at your photo of F-WTSS's flight deck, i should think the flight crew were glad it was changed, so little forward view with the original visor! Must have felt a bit claustrophobic in there.

                          Anyway, on YouTube i have just found a video (Edited) of Concordes circumnavigation of the globe, well worth looking at. The plane was G-BOAD, sadly this is the plane that suffered vandalism and also had it's nose knocked off by a passing truck whilst it was being stored at the Floyd Bennett Field Airfield in New York during 2008.


                          Credit: Maisel/News

                          Full news story HERE.

                          Hard to believe it's the same plane featured in the videos below.

                          Part One.



                          Part Two. (4062 miles in 3 hours and 40 minutes!)



                          Part Three. (I think the Quantas 747-400 pilot in this episode is just a little bit jealous!).



                          Part Four.



                          Part Five.



                          So how about a CV plane to go with the CV Yacht? I reckon this one will do nicely!
                          Last edited by Steve.B; February 7th, 2010, 03:38.
                          Your charts, your radar, your eyes and ears - if all 4 agree, you may proceed with caution.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Steve, what a fabulous tribute to the Great White Swan! Interesting that neither the British or the French never tried to better the Concorde, even now I get that unreal comparison with the EEC Lightning. Both Concorde and the Lightning were thunderous & amazing aircraft, I lean towards the road that both aircraft could have been kept flying. Okay the Lightning was in need of upgrading, but Concorde for me had a shed load of life left in her. Or am I just living in a mist of nostalgia?
                            Infamy, Infamy.... They've got it in for me! Said The Laughing Assassin.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Imagine. Just imagine.

                              Work starts in £15m plan to get Concorde flying

                              The engines on a French Concorde are to be examined as the first move in a £15m project aiming to get the supersonic passenger jet back in the air.

                              The Rolls Royce engines of the former Air France Concorde will undergo an initial examination to see what work needs to be done to start the engines.


                              >>> The whole story here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8712806.stm?lsm
                              With best regards from Jan-Olav Storli

                              Administrator and Owner of CaptainsVoyage.
                              Main page: http://www.captainsvoyage.com
                              Old forum: http://captainsvoyage.7.forumer.com/
                              Join us: Save the "Kong Olav" on facebook

                              Surround yourself with positive, ethical people who are committed to excellence.

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